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Hello

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and welcome to Episode Four of too much Tally. We are currently

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in lockdown stage four so I'm coming to you live from my home. I have Jesse my producer Jess. Hello. Hey guys, I miss you all ready to go so far. I'm so upset that we can't clean classes today. I know we're gonna have to pretend to clink our glasses and as you can say, I'm coming to you live from my house. I have a bar right behind me but I've got a bottle to drink for this episode. Just obviously we're not together. So we've got different drinks talk me through what you've tuned out for tonight. I've gone for something different. I've gone for vodka and kombucha.

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Oh and a nice little wedge of lemon.

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That sounds like a really delicious but also kind of healthy but frogs. Yeah, Severino, I'm going to pop another bottle of sparkling bud and had I just figured if I just keep drinking these guys on air, they may eventually sponsor the show. That's where my head's at at the moment. So I'm gonna pop that and pour a glass. Right One, two. Oh, okay, so today we're talking about sexuality I guess I

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obviously I used to date women I considered myself bisexual

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for a minute there. I thought I was gay. Now I consider myself I guess, heterosexual

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quia I'm not even sure to be honest. So I'm going to talk you through kind of how I came to that realisation as a very, very little Tally. We then have some questions from you guys. We opened up the Instagram at too much Tali and got a bunch of very interesting questions from you guys that we're going to answer. And then finally, we've got my ex girlfriend, Talia Ferran. He's going to hop on and join us which I am super excited about. I've got a drink Jess, you have a drink. Let's get into it.

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So I'd love to go back in time and get a good turn back time. I've had one bad Good, bad. Oh too much. Right up. That's why I love you always have my back. Sorry, as you were, as I was. I'd love to go back in time and hear about your story. Cuz obviously you have been gay. Now you're not Yeah, well, I thought I was gay. What about you Jess? You're How do you identify? I'm strike. Strike. 100% Yeah, I've never been with women. Have you considered? I can't say I have to be honest. Yeah, I feel like I just go towards men with beards and oh, I cry. All right, so we like a graph like Kay of man. Kind of like I'm gonna go chop some wood vibe. That's it attacked everywhere beards hair, just, you know. Okay, so you're definitely not into women? I understand. Yeah, yeah. So my story actually goes really far back. And I think that this is something that you really don't think about until much later down the track. Like I wasn't thinking at the time that this was anything weird. I just remember so clearly having these thoughts. So I guess if we want a ride back, it goes way back to kindergarten. And how do we in Kenya? I think I was four years old. So it's Yeah, pretty young. And I had my first best friend at primary school. Her name was Cathy and I loved her to death I used to we used to walk on the playground holding hands. And I remember being at home after school one day and jumping on my trampoline and this is such a like introspective thought for a four year old who has no exposure to galas and community you know, there were no TV shows back then. What you would have been like nine to 91 no TV shows no movies, I had no role models, no family members, no friends, nothing nothing in my life. But I remember thinking so clearly. I remember being worried that I loved Cathy too much. Like I remember thinking I would just go down I was thinking about how lucky I am to have a friend like Kathy and how much I love Kathy. But I remember thinking Is this normal? like yeah, how Wait is that for a four year old to think? I mean, I can't even remember that far back. So the fact that you you know feeling these things and can remember it is phenomenal. Well, I think another reason it sticks in my memory is because Because I actually got called to the principal's office, and was sat down and told that I had to let Cathy make other friends. Because I was a little bit possessive. And I wasn't, I got upset if she wandered off and play with other other girls. Yeah. And my mom was absolutely livid. She couldn't believe that I'd had this you know, really serious adult chat with the principal where she wanted to be consulted first, your mom as well in a, you know, having to talk to the principal that young as well.

I just I just remember it being a massive big deal in my household. But yeah, so Kathy was kind of the first and I, I don't I never had a crush on her later on in school, you know, we went to the same primary school, and that didn't develop in any way, shape or form. I just think that was my first sort of really close female friendship that I that I had that meant something to me, and I met the questioning whether it was normal to care or do we thinking about Kathy so much, which is just so bizarre to me. And then we had Ada now to like preface this, I've actually spoken to ADA and I've asked her whether I can tell this story because, you know, it doesn't just involve Maine and Voltaire as well and and so I asked if I could tell our story she said yes, yes, absolutely go for it. You know, it's so long ago but also it's a sweet story. So, as we may or may not know, Jess, um, I know I've got a face for podcasting but I actually once one time was a model. I know Chicago Chicago, but I was horse you a look at you head up. I was in the girlfriend model set in 2003 mimic girlfriend magazine. Yeah. Did you eat with girlfriend or Dolly fans? I think you either one or the other. To be honest, I was a magazine gal so I love Yeah. Probably enough in media to be Yeah. I think everyone had dreams of doing that. Right. I tried to journalism I want to do like magazines. I collected them. I had them all in stacks in like date Oda and like Brant. I was Mary Sue day goes very far back. Yeah. Anyway, so I was approached at rumba Music Festival and they said, Have you ever considered modelling? And I said, No, I haven't. But I was really I was lanky and gawky and I didn't have that self confidence, but I, I guess physically I looked like a baby giraffe, which, you know, generally baby giraffes make great models. Anyway, long story short, I got through I was New South Wales finalist and I met a very sassy 16 year old with short spiky hair, called Ruby Rose. Hmm, who we all we all now know. She is a you know, an actress. She's an activist. She's DJ, she's a model. She's so many things. She's killing it in the US. She's an artist and you black. She's been named Meg the movie. She's been in john wick. She was just fat woman like she's killing it, killing it. But back then she was just Ruby. Anyway, she even back then like she's just always been a force to be reckoned with. And we will all scattered and we were all told once we got through to not change our parents because obviously they've scouted US based on what we look like. Ruby decides to she had really long, dark hair down to her sort of boobs, and she decides as a bit of Fuck you. I don't know why, but she was just, she's always bother. I feel like she's got that bad ass kind of girl does. She's always But even as a sorry, I was 15 she was 1616 year old she had it anyway, so she thought Fuck you and she cut her hair off to like a pixie cut. Yeah. And rocks up to the airport. And there's a magazine, golfer magazine representative. They're looking for this girl that she's got a photo of with long brown hair and she was like, Hi. Looking for me. It's me. Yeah, like obviously that couldn't be like, Oh, no, sorry, you've cut your hair off. You can't be in competition. So like she was already making her own rules way back then. And again, like I've never been around gay. As young people, I didn't have any role models, I would know TV shows, you know, Katy Perry was, there was no one around. And I just remember instantly being so enamoured with her. And there's just something about Ruby that she just she commands her room, she's got this presence about her that really

draws you in. And so we will staying, I think, also requests, like service departments or something in Paddington, and I was a bit bummed because I was from Sydney. So like everyone else had been flown in. And then I just had to get in the car and drive, you know, 20 minutes to the station. Totally. And you know, it was still fun, but I would love to I would love to trip. Anyway. So we will all stand on his apartments. And we had you had to pick bedrooms and I was just I just knew I really wanted to be with Ruby. My husband to be Ruby's best friend. I'm so impressed with her. I thought she was so cool. And she's only a year older than me. But Gosh, she had so much more life experience. She was wise beyond her years still is she's been through a lot in her life anyway, so we ended up banking together and I was just obsessed. And back then I thought it was just like I was, which was really cool. I thought I wanted to be a friend. I just thought she was just the coolest thing ever. She had tattoos already. And so do you think that you were beginning to feel that sexual attraction to Ruby or no, no, I was more just like very interested in who she was and what she was about because she was unlike anyone I've ever met before in my entire life. Like she was another world. I was a sheltered, private school girl. All my friends have blond hair, blue eyes, you know, in a really nice suburban house, you know, back then, mum was probably only just showing signs so my life was pretty much picture. Perfect. Yeah. And then he comes this spiky haired, tattooed sassy like attitude problem. You know, I think she was should already she didn't bicep nourish couldn't be like myself. She just had to just so much going on. Yeah, just the fact that she had tattoos. I was like, What? She's like, yeah, like I designed that myself. I was like, that's so fucking cool. And I'm crazy for someone so young as well. Oh my god insane and I never never never ever ever forget this. We were like setting ourselves up to the bedrooms. It was so exciting. So second hotel, I remember being like, Oh, this is so lame. But this is how young and how exciting it was back then. I was like, we can call anyone we look for these phones and they have to pay for it. Like that. Yeah, and like we had a bunch of girlfriend magazines and like goodie bags and I'm in but this is so immature. But again, we'll 1516 we opened up all the pads nowadays always put pads in those magazines. You get like a BA in the middle. Yeah, we have enough all of them and just stuck them to the windows of the hotel. We don't know why. Anyway, she had she bought a CD and then put the CD on and we're like, Okay, cool. Like what is it like finger boys and it was After all the things she said all the things she said, a true like awakening moment for any you know by quia girl maintains when that came out and was like, Wait, what? Firstly, there are two girls who are talking about other girls in the field that was super sexy. And then their room is are they dating? Are they sisters? Are they friends? What's the deal? Remember though, right, it was a huge moment in pop culture history and Ruby had opened my eyes. She bought the CD, she was blasting it. We were like, wait, what is this and she was like singing the word. And she showed us the film clip and my mind my little mind was blown. And then the other thing that happened that same trip was when we eventually you know, we using the phones I was like, I'm gonna call my dad and I call my dad. I didn't even know my best friend's number back then. Yeah, and she was like, I'm gonna call my girlfriend and we were like, Haha, yeah, like girlfriend like besties and she's like, no, my like my girlfriend. Just like Oh, wow. And I remember and she loves giving me shit for this now, apparently then I got really weird.

Apparently from that moment onwards, I was really awkward and shy and I suddenly didn't want to share a bed with her. And I was just really like, uncomfortable. Which is so bizarre because Can you imagine me being uncomfortable anything? Firstly, no, I can't write. And I must have just been I just think I was processing it. To be honest. I think that I didn't expect it. I didn't know the sight like now I can I can smell it. I can smell them from a mile away. Like I see like a glimpse of something and I'm like, gay. Yeah, but back then I didn't have a gay duh. And I didn't know what lesbians look like. And I didn't pick up that she was one. Um, she was probably the first person that made me start because I thought she was so cool. And I really looked up to her. She kind of became like a big sister to me. She experienced a lot of bullying at school and I had just changed schools from a private school to a public school and was getting bullied mercilessly, colour and T is off to school in just being like I don't want to do and she was a great source of support for me back then. So I think because I thought she was so cool. Suddenly her being gay was cool too. And like it wasn't a big deal and she was comfortable in her own skin. Like why would not become from my own skin? Yeah. So she was like the first person that I guess the first gay person in my life that kind of opened my eyes to a whole new rainbow world. Mm hmm. And yeah, then I met ADA. So ADA was a girlfriend is that right? Can I say that? You know what she bought? She should have been but I didn't have the guts like she should have been she wanted to be and I just need to pour another drink for this. This is like this still makes me feel funny. I know. We've been talking about this off air and it makes me feel funny still. And it's been like how many how many years like a gazillion years. 15 Oh, sorry. Yeah, so it wasn't enough. It was a girl that went to To a neighbouring Golf School that no if you eat I'm sure this is common thing. So we went to one school and then she went to a school that was nearby so we caught the bus to school together we would meet at the bus stop. And she was friends with another very good friend of mine dads who was the first girl in my high school to come out as gay. Hmm. And she's one of my best friends and everyone loved it wasn't a big deal. I love to everyone love to non issue but she she's Filipino does Filipina and so i was i don't i think i don't know that i met it three days. I would hang out the bus stop. You know, I suddenly got really excited to go to the bus stop super early because I wanted extra time to hang out with ADA and her other friends and and it was dad one day that was like, oh, I'll never forget it from afar. And I remember I remember what I was doing. I was sitting on the floor of my bedroom, leaning up against my bed still in my school uniform. I probably only just gotten home from school when I was already on the phone talking to my friends as you do when you're a teenage girl and As said, it's your sexy Phil seek talking about it. Dad said, I think you like a tonne more than a friend and I think I'd like you to

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add your processor.

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I instantly denied denied and I was like what? No, that's ridiculous. What are you talking about? I think so What like why are you saying that's so dumb? Yeah, not, not not but I instantly like my, my stomach dropped my heart dropped. I knew she was right. He was just so weird having someone say the words or like voice it out loud. I did also notice that as well. Oh, for sure. For sure. And it was insane. And and from then it was like she planted a seed and then suddenly it wasn't so scary. And then the more we spoke it was in that time when you know you go to parties and you'd get really drunk and everyone would be making out just for fun. And if you you obviously do we do that? In our

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small town. I am an art I still to this day don't have any lesbian friends.

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Okay, that I mean, so I'm sheltered a little bit not super surprising. It was just like one of those times where like, you'd go out and like, guys, like you guys should make out what? Okay, and so it kind of wasn't a huge deal to be making out with girls. But I recently bought a new car, as you know. Yes. You know, as I knew it, Betty, Betty, the black Mazda, and I was going through a bunch of stuff that was in the back that I should have had in storage, but I didn't. And I actually found a love letter from Ada to me. I'm so excited for this. Okay, I'm going to read it. So this is the first time hair and I kissed

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ever, okay,

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and I'm going to have to skip some parts because we had our own. We had our own language, we made up our own little language. And so there are words in here that honour the meaning of that no one else will so I'm going to skip over those bits also. Author permission to say she was the most in terms of romance. I mean, women are so much more romantic. I didn't write me letters all the time long, long letters. Yeah, that have feelings about it about her day about everything. That is definitely one thing that women have over men hands down without question. Don't ask me. Okay, so I'm going to read you. I can. I'm sorry. No. Okay. I feel like it honestly just takes me right back. This takes me right back to this moment. Okay, if there's one moment that I would really call crazy, it would be that time it does his house. Okay, actually, it's not that crazy because people hook up all the time. But I think it was crazy for me because it actually meant something. I don't know about you, but I always wanted it to happen. And I just didn't think it would. I mean, we both very drunk. So we've been the usual drunk Fox that we always are until we're in this room and suddenly I find myself locked in there with you and you only in the dark. I'm sorry, but how fucking dangerous is that want to be? And I remember that I didn't even want to be in the room because all I wanted to do was kiss you. And then you kiss me and I died even for ages to It's so weird because whilst kissing you the party went away, the music stopped, and other people seemed like they weren't even there. Then it was sort of like it didn't matter if we were in the dark, and all I could think of was you and the fact that I was kissing you. The one person I wanted to be kissing and the world stopped. Honestly, that's never happened to me before and it totally blew me away. I couldn't brave. I don't know what that means. Actually. Maybe I do. I don't know. Maybe I don't but it felt right. It felt as if that's the only place where I wanted to be. That's the only place I could imagine being with you.

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That is so nice.

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How do you feel writing that back and does it take you back to when you read it takes it back to the moment we were at a house party. For some reason she was in one of the bedrooms in the in the dock and then I think someone shoved me into the room. And then Luke shut it locked in a room together is obviously a play by one of our friends. But we were literally locked in the room and they left us and we couldn't get out of the room. And we remember sitting by the bus, side by side, with our backs against the dole in complete darkness, and the air was so thick, and the tension was tangible. And yeah, it just it's crazy reading it back and finding that just randomly before we even decided to do this episode, because the emotions and the feelings are just so intense, and it was so intense back then it's so overwhelming. Realising that I mean, it's so fun when you realise that you're in love with someone anyway, but realising that you might be in love with a female, when you've never thought about that before or had that in your future is is just not it's

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hard. It's hard. And but it's

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also amazing and exciting. Yeah. Um, so you mentioned before that you didn't date her. Is that right? So yeah, have you used told your family and your friends at this stage she you know, I still it still doesn't it still doesn't sit well with me It still is upsetting. She was all in. She would have been my girlfriend, she was happy to come out. She was happy to hold my hand in public. She was happy to call me Hi girlfriend. I just couldn't do it. I I was scared and I you know, I still dated guys. You know, we just went on for years her and I we would just would just make out a potties, I never, we never slept together. We'd just be at a party with my boyfriend and I'd like run off and drag her into the bathroom and we'd like make out. It must have been so tough in hindsight for her to have to watch me be with boyfriends and watch me be comfortable being with them and being public with them but not feeling comfortable enough to come out and be with her. I can't even imagine what that would have felt like for her. So you said just then as well. Sorry to cut you off, but that she hadn't come out either. So you've both kind of Yeah, and she was Filipino. So you know like that's a whole different kettle of fish with that. They've got quite traditional family values. They're quite religious usually. But she would have thrown it all. She would have risked it all for me and I just didn't have the bowls I I couldn't do it. And I think I broke her heart. She actually ended up terms of common being a bitch. Checking end up dating one of my best friends who I had no idea was even considering her sexuality until I found out they were together and that fucking broke me. And it broke me doubly, because I knew I had no right to be broken. I couldn't come out and say, How dare you? How can you do this to me because I knew that he would. If I if I had been down she would have been with me And who am I to stop her from dating other people and having love with someone else but it fucking ruined me. Because I had even lied to my best friends. I've been lying to everybody and then so I had to be okay with them. In front of me at potties making out it was fine your rific they know now you know my friends my that my friend and I no longer friends we just fell off to high school I don't think we ever had a conversation about it. I had taken this. I had looked him in the eyes and swore my life that I wasn't gay that I didn't like girls and it wasn't with Ada that I didn't love Ada i'd swore black and blue. And I didn't know I just I couldn't go back on that. It's it's traumatic, but yeah, so that was that was probably my first love. Yeah, if I'm being honest. And then there was Steph.

22:39
Who Steph?

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Steph was my first actual girlfriend.

22:44
Yeah. Um,

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so yeah, as I said, I dated guys and stuff throughout the rest of high school. I had my first serious boyfriend in year 12. Who else I'm 22 surprises so many people. I think people think because I'm so open and comfortable with my sexuality. Talking about sex that I like, was a really like early startup. Yeah. But I was attained. So I like, it was important to me. I'm actually really old school and have some weird values old school values and I wanted to be in a relationship. I wanted to be a long term relationship. I wanted to love him. I wanted it to be special. So that happened, you know, in year 12. And then I got into university at Charleston University and Baptist, CSU represent. And I still had my boyfriend at the time he had gone on a gap year so he was doing like the Euro boys through it. It was it was tough. It was before sort of, you know, he was calling me from payphones and would have these really disjointed conversations and I felt so far away from him and so far away from my family and friends and Sydney, because that this is three hours basically. And I was just feeling really isolated and really alone, to be honest. And then one day, I look at my dorm room. So we Live in little huts in in the, in the university like on campus. And I looked at my dorm room and I saw this girl with ripped jeans and like a banteay skateboarding to class. I'm seeing a theme here. And I was like, Fuck, she's cool. Like she was just so cool. At the time, you know, as I just said, in terms of not having the balls to be open with ADA. At the time, I was someone who cared so much what people think of me like I people's opinions really affected me. Obviously, that's changed a lot over the years. I wouldn't be doing this podcast if that was the case, trust me. But at the time, you know, I was really insecure I was really mumbos point by this point man was quite sick. My home life was all up in the air. I just moved, you know, I was I didn't know who I was. And this instead of just did not care. And that was just so obvious to me like She broke all the rules, she'd flip people off. I just she was just this really, really cool chick and then she shaved her head for cancer. So she shaved all her hair off and I was like, fuck that is just like an amazing human being. And she was very much out. She was well known for being out. She had quite a reputation on campus. Everyone loved her guys wanted to be a friend girls wanted to be with her. And she actually had a girlfriend in a neighbouring dorm to me, literally next door to me. And so I kind of just for a while just admired from afar, like a little crepe. We became friends. I remember finding it surprising that I had a tongue ring. She thought that was really cool. I think she thought that I was probably a little strange when it came and I thought that having a tongue ring made me really edgy and and I love that she she was surprised by it. I didn't even know you had a tongue ring. I did. I had everything paid. I had my tongue pierced my nose pierced have my nipple pierced. I was a cool chick one time. Anyway, we just became friends and then yeah, before we knew we were having sleepovers in our little single dorm room beds. Yeah. And I felt hard and fast for her. She would, she'd write me she'd paint me pictures. She'd made me mix CDs. She brought me beautiful love notes. And she sent me feel I think in a time that I was feeling so lost and scared for my for my mom for my home life. I felt so loved by her. But again, I just the thought of having to come out or like tell people we were together was terrifying. And we kept our relationship a secret for ages. For ages, she'd sneak to my dorm room, she'd sneak out and we'd be holding hands they would see someone else and would throw her hand away. I was just scared. I was I was really scared. And I broke up with my boyfriend by the way. It was done. We assumed she'd she'd she'd left her girlfriend. We've been single Yeah.

And then one day we were at a uni bought, and I had this terrible pub in Bathurst and, and she got really upset and she pulled me outside and we sat in the gutter and she started crying and stuff is just not someone who cries. She's just not she's so strong and stoic and dislike, I don't give a fuck. And she was a mess. And I asked him, what's wrong? What's going on? And she's like, I can't do this anymore. She's like, I love you. I'm in love with you. I want to be with you. And I can't be a little secret anymore. It's killing me. I can't have you deny me anymore. I can't pretend this isn't going on. It's breaking my heart and I can't do it anymore. And I could tell by looking at her that she wasn't fucking around. Like I'd broken her. She was distraught. And I knew that this was the makeup break. And I knew that this was a that I have the balls. And I own my feelings and I own my sexuality. And I tell the world that I love this woman. Or I lose her forever and I wasn't prepared to lose it. Time I wasn't gonna do that again. So I said, Okay, fine. And she was like, What? What? Like, fine. Let's do it. Let's tell everybody. Let's do it. She's like, Are you serious? And I was like, yep. If that's what's gonna make you happy? If you need that for me, then let's do it. And she literally dragged me by the hand inside, ran through the pub packed of uni students packed about friends. I was like, This is my girlfriend were together. This is my girlfriend. And I was terrified. But everyone was like,

28:29
duh. Of course you are. Yeah. Like, we haven't noticed you guys

28:34
like hanging out. 24 seven sneaking off, coming to each other's words late at night. Like

28:39
do you really think we haven't noticed

28:40
that? And it was just such this non event and I felt guilty for being so worried and so stressed out about it. It was actually quite funny. Like I was kind of, I think, Steph. I think maybe Steph knew that that was the case. But I was Yeah, it was a terribly. I still

28:54
know that's so exciting, though.

28:55
I know. So then how did you because I think a lot of the issues or, you know, the scariness maybe that sometimes gay people might feel is when they have to tell their families. Did you ever face that? How did you go with that conversation? What's funny, I was going about telling my friends, even though in height, they were actually back, they reacted. The worst, they found it really jarring. And they didn't. They felt like they didn't know who I was anymore. The two sort of people I was scared of telling were my ex boyfriend. Because I didn't want him to take it personally because it really had nothing to do with him. And I could see how that how he that he might take it personally, and I was just so scared that he would think what have I done? Was it me? Did I break her? It just really had nothing to do with him. So I was worried about telling him and then obviously my family. My family. My parents are a little bit older. They're quite traditional. Again, you know, we didn't have any gay family members or gay family friends, so I just didn't know how to take it. Basically, one day asked Dad, I said dad, my friend from New York Coming up stay the night and he that's the beauty about being in a lesbian relationship when you're that

30:05
young is that at bat an eyelash if you have a girlfriend,

30:08
exactly, but she wrapped up with a shaved head. She had a T shirt that said sick bitch on a skateboard. And she had ripped jeans. And I'm not sure if he knew them. But he basically she basically didn't leave my house for three years.

30:25
And he treated her as if

30:28
she was his own. She didn't have a father figure in her life. So he changed the oil in her car, you know, he'd help her fix things. One time she came over on the cup was so bad. She came over and she left her beloved combs. She had these white cones that she'd had years she'd taken to all kinds of music festivals had been travelling with her they had so much memory and history involved in them. And she'd left them outside of our house. I slept at home obviously, and dead found them and he scrubbed them clean on no she was

30:59
dead.

31:00
stated he was helping and she was like,

31:02
thank you so much, but she was so upset.

31:05
That's so sweet of him though. I know. That wasn't my but it was kind of funny to laugh at it now but mom was quite far gone. And by this point, she was very forgetful. Very Dotty was quite ill with dementia. And she Steph and I were making out on my bed in quite a compromising position. I mean, making out but quite compromising position. And mom just opened my bedroom door and walked in on us. I know can you just it makes me feel sick thinking about it. Can you ever been there? Really Have you?

31:35
Exactly it just adds to the layout?

31:37
Well, yeah, yeah, it's shoot anyway. It's a terrible thing to happen anyway. But imagine adding an extra layer of email and your parents not knowing that you're into email.

31:46
And just Oh, sorry, should not next

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time and I was like I literally threw myself okay. threw myself off the bed ricocheted off my like, it was just it was a comedy of errors. Lunch out the door Steph was like cool, so I'm dying in this room. She's like, I'm never leaving. That's that then I guess she was gonna have to bury me onto your bed. She's like, there's no way I can face your parents. I'm not going home tonight. I literally am not going out. So I'm like, we have to we can't stay here forever. I didn't have an en suite for one. Anyway, I've actually got the balls to leave the bedroom and stuff and say goodbye to my mom. And she had no recollection. She'd forgotten the whole thing. You know, swings and roundabouts.

32:29
So yeah,

32:30
that was Steph my first love and my first heartbreak. She also broke my heart into a million pieces. And that was actually the first time that my dad ever made a comment about it. I was a mess. I was so heartbroken. I couldn't imagine my life without her. I couldn't imagine ever loving anyone ever again. As you do with your first heartbreak. You think it's you know, no one's ever gonna understand and I'm hurting more than anyone else ever has before. And I think I came out of my bedroom for the first time in days I hadn't been eating and and I was lovely. Looked terrific and dad pulled me in for a big hug and he said pumpkin I know it hurts, but I promise you it will get better. And that's kind of the only time he ever really acknowledged that he knew Steph was my girlfriend.

33:13
That was it. That's nice. So you went on after Steph today, other females as well.

33:18
Obviously people like people called me a stiff BM. They all thought that it was just stiff. There's just something about Steph there really is she's now an amazing photographer in New York City. She's married. I went to her wedding. She's married to a beautiful woman called George but she's killing it in New York. Yeah. And people just thought it was just Steph, but I went on today. We have predominantly women for six years after that. There was deaf and there was Brooke. Then there was Sabrina and then there was Talia. We all know that Talia don't we do we do. In fact, I think she's trying to hop on now.

33:53
All right, Telly, you go fill the glass. I'm gonna bring in Talia.

33:56
Let's do it.

33:59
Hey, guys. It's producer Jess here, just jumping in to let you know that we've split this episode into two parts. In part two we hear from Kelly's ex girlfriend about a coming out story and they answer your burning questions about Big Brother, and anything else to do with being gay. Thanks so much for listening and we'll see you over at Part Two